To the corner of Fort & Livernois for today’s P.D.J.
This handsome peice of automotive history was built in 1928
The same artist who painted the windows at the U.A. prior to its superbowl wash also did the former offices of Fisher Body. Does anyone know the significance of the “S” and the “C”?
Although the name has been off the building for a long time, the GM logo as well as Fisher Body are both still visible.
Here is a present day shot from Google Earth of the offices. You can see the original structure outlined in red, as noted on the Sandborn below.
From the Sandborn map from 1921, the office building (much smaller) and factory show up as the Ternstedt Manufacturing Company.
Here’s a little blurb from 1968 about Ternstedt:
Ternstedt Rejoins Fisher Body
DETROIT, MICH., Nov. 4, 1968– Ternstedt and Fisher Body Division– separated two decades ago when Ternstedt was made a separate General Motors division– are being united again.
Chairman of the Board James M. Roche announced today that consolidation of Ternstedt into Fisher Body Division will permit increased coordination of automotive body design and engineering. The headquarters of the two divisions now face each other across one of the Technical Center lakes.
Ternstedt was named after its founder, Alvar K. Ternstedt, inventor of the first practical car window regulator. A native of Sweden, he applied for a patent on his invention in 1911 but it was not granted until 1916.
The regulator utilized a chain and sprocket mechanism that offered greater east of operation than any previous device. Ternstedt needed financial backing to start his own company so in 1917 he invited the Fishers and several others to join him. At that time, the Fisher organization was already the largest body-building firm in the world.
At a meeting in Detroit on April 17, 1917, the Ternstedt Manufacturing Co. was incorporated. Ternstedt was elected chairman. The seven other directors were four of the Fisher brothers and three other major Fisher Body Company shareholders.
But Ternstedt didn’t live long enough to enjoy the success of his venture. He died six months later and in 1920, Fisher Body acquired the Ternstedt firm.
When Fisher Body became a division of GM in 1926, Ternstedt became a division within Fisher Body. Ternstedt became a separate division in 1948 and now, 20 years later, is now rejoining Fisher Body.
Alvar Ternstedt lived long enough to start manufacturing operations at a building located at Fort Street and Livernois in Detroit, site of the present Fisher Body Fort Street Plant. That remained the Ternstedt headquarters until a new divisional office building on the Tech Center site in 1962.
At present, Ternstedt operates seven plants and has nearly 25,000 employees. There are 400 Ternstedt products on the average GM car such as door handles, window regulators, locks, wheel covers and many of the brightly-plated trim parts found on vehicles.
Also from the GM corporate history section of their website:
1926 – General Motors purchases the Fisher brothers’ remaining interest in Fisher Body Co. William Fisher, president of Fisher Body Corp., becomes general manager of GM’s new Fisher Body division. The acquisition includes Ternstedt Manufacturing Company, which is engaged in the manufacture of automobile body hardware and metal stampings. In 1933, Ternstedt is made a division of General Motors. Brown-Lipe-Chapin, a supplier of differential gears for General Motors cars acquired in 1922, is made a division of General Motors in 1926 and consolidated with Ternstedt in 1962. In 1968, Ternstedt Division is consolidated into Fisher Body Division.
Click here to see some the the radiator caps produced by the Ternstedt Mfg. Co.
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My boss is restoring a 1931 Buick Coupe, Series 8-96.
He found the following info:
Fisher Body Corporation, Detroit, Michigan
Correspondence Pertaining to me:
Job #31122, Body#156
Bottom Plate: Buick Motor Company 31-MOD, 8-96
We are trying to locate history on this vehicle as to date manufactured and where manufactured. Any info would be appreciated.
2nd Part of GM Rip Off of Employee Suggestion -
This operation was very clever in fact it would had gone un notice if they hadn't be so hasted in stealing my suggestion. I found out by the grace of fate that the overseer corindator of the Employee Suggestion Program was having weekend meeting with certain staff members at his manson in his Study Room. There they would go through employees sugestions that were coming up on the 1 yr anniversity dead line and would re write the same suggestion just a little different but would had the same idea. Later after several months an employee would see his idea in operation saving money and time and could not do anything about it. This went on for many years. If you do not believe me research most all of the top suggestions and you will see the same top management of employees reaping the $$$$$.
Nagy's Family were the main con artists...
After nearly 30 years I must tell the story of how GM let CEO's get a buy out of over millions of dollars - and that years the employees did not get any bonus.
The GM Credit Union was rigged also, by a clever person who started loaning money charging a .25 cent on a dollar. Later in years the Credit Union was started and this person was the one over it program, and put most of his family in good position in salary and hourly positions. Most of the hard hourly worker could not get a loan for a down payment of a house, but certain ones could get thousands to purchase homes.
What a shame how GM let this go on for years....
When it came to my case - I was bless in get EEOC Chairman to be with me... GM BIG Shots was very suprise at my deposition with EEOC. You should have seen their faces.
dwight.norris@cox.net
Norris, a lot of places are like that. If you're a engineer at a company or an engineering professor at a university and invent something related to your tenure, who gets the royalties? The company or the university. They don't pay you a yearly salary to invent something and then allow you the right to sell it to the highest bidder. They invest in your creativity. That's the way it works! If you don't like it, don't expect to collect a salary while you're inventing things.
If you have a union job and offer a suggestion, it's a suggestion that will keep your job and the company in business in North America because often times top down styles of management miss things that only the front line worker can see and because they miss this, the CEO ends up moving their operations to cheaper labour countries like Mexico or China when these money saving suggestions, had they been brought to the CEOs attention, could have saved the local plant. It's also known as continuous improvement, or Kaizen, the Japanese style of management. You are offering money saving suggestions to keep your high union paying job. You should be glad they're listening to their employee suggestions on how to make a local company profitable and not pack up and leave for Mexico.
It's this kind of union mentality of hating management that motivated GM to move a lot of their operations to Mexico. The unemployment levels in this area are high enough and evil corporation union mentality has gotta stop if we want companies to invest in this area again.
If a credit union is committing "usury" (a criminal offense in Canada or the US), you report them to the police, federal regulators, or your Member or Parliament or Congressman. There's actual laws to deal with unethical stuff like that. But, they never found anything wrong, did they?
If you don't like the way a company operates, quit and work somewhere else. I got a better idea, why don't you follow GM to Mexico and make a few dollars a day as a line worker. Or better yet, if you think you have so many smart ideas, why don't you go back to university and use your lawsuit proceeds to earn your MBA and try to be a CEO yourself and get this "big" buyout if you think the job looks so easy!
I thank you for your reaction and responding negatively on this Employee’s Suggestion Program for Union Employees as well as for Salaries Employees at any of the BIG 3 Auto Factories in Northern America. I did not have any negative opinion against GM Employee Suggestion Programs – This Program is a GREAT INCENTIVE for the Employees and the Company, my concerns was with the Overseer of these types of programs that was gear to allow the union type employee to be a part of the improvements to try to save jobs from going OVERSEA.
The Front line employee see more where improvement could make a big difference in saving his or her job, but if the program in geared unfairly..this bring down the morale for this program.
If a union employee or as you say the front line employee feel as if their suggestions never get recognition and see that others get to benefit from their inventiveness of their suggestion, than why should the front line employee even participate in this Employee’s Suggestion when the Overseers are benefiting from the greater suggestion from the employees. (This type of actions makes the employee morale in the program low)
The rules are geared for this type of thievery to be easily committed. If the rules were changed as for the TIME LIMIT OF OWNERSHIP – that a suggestion that a Employee would put in would stay part of their ownership as long as the Employee in employed. If one was to get a patent # on their idea, than this idea will be on record for longer than a year, this was how the OVERSEER can easily come in a steal the small union employee suggestion of thousand of dollars savings because on these rules of the Suggestion Program was so easily to get around to be able to steal suggestions.
It was not GM CEO’s or Higher Management fault, they probably doesn’t even know and don’t even get involve in such a program for Employees. But if once in a while if they would just come down and just check on line employees in how they are being treated unfairly in this Suggestion Program, maybe it would confirm and give motivation creativity back to the union front line employee. Investigate on who been getting the larger monetarily benefits.
So I thank you again, it seems to me that you know a great deal concerning these types of incentive programs for the employees.
And as far as the CREDIT UNION BEING STARTED with the type of unfairness to loan money to certain employees to buy homes in the late 60's and 70's was not fair at all.
I wonder if you DAVID know more than you are saying?
DAVID
The Japanese management encourages employees to generate a great number of suggestions and works hard to consider and implement these suggestions, often incorporating them into the overall Kaizen strategy. Management also gives due recognition to employee's efforts for improvement. An important aspect of the suggestion system is that each suggestion, once implemented, leads to an upgraded standard
ONE CAN SEE HOW THE JAPANESE MANAGEMENT GET INVOLVE WITH THE FRONT LINE WORKERS, MAKING SURE THAT THE SUGGESTION PROGRAMS / KAIZEN IS FAIR IN ALL FASHION, SHAPE AND FORM.
NOW WONDER THE JAPANESE HAVE SUCH A HIGHER PRODUCTION COUNT AND BETTER PRODUCE CARS, THEIR CEO, MANAGEMENT MAKE SURE THE ONE THAT OVER A SUGGESTION PROGRAM IS CAREFULLY WATCH! - GM SHOULD HAVE DID THE SAME WITH THE NAGY'S OF DETROIT TERNSTEDT PLANT OF WEST FORT STREET, MAYBE THAN THAT PLANT WOULD HAVE STAY OPEN, AND SO MANY OTHERS WOULD NOT HAD TO MOVE TO MEXICO. YOU SEE DAVID HOW A BAD APPLE OVERSEER CAN F----K UP THINGS FOR EVERYONE.
Hi, I have a Chevy 1947 and I need informations about it.
Please, could you help me find what does digits means?.
Style nº : V47 2103
Body nº: 1339
Trim nº : WC
Paint nº: 213 "or" 713 (this digits is not clear)
Top:
Thanks
Marcio Cruz
Acc:
I have two 1928 chevrolet cowls. Both JOB No. 8170
One has Body no. S 56512
the other has Body no. S 14396
Is it possible to tell me what body these two cowls came from?
thanks
Dave Elmore
Newark, IL
Yes, I can tell you about William Schnell. The Clarendon address was his law firm, not his personal residence.
To fully appreciate the genius of William Schnell, it is helpful to return to the period in which he made his enduring contributions to the
automotive industry. The Golden Age of the automobile hood
ornament of the 1920s and 1930s grew with the rapid rise of
industrial progress in the US. During this time, America was coming
to grips with the new and aesthetically unpopular technology of mass
production. Consumers and car manufacturers alike sought a way to
make the motorcar unique, to give the buyer a product that was different from his neighbor’s. The introduction of original decorative car parts, particularly hood ornaments, gave drivers that personal touch.
Ternstedt Manufacturing Company, the first styling studio for General Motors and other car manufacturers, was the industry leader in automotive trim design during this era. Their advertisements proclaimed, “The addition of radiator emblems to the line of Ternstedt products affords the industry a distinctive means of individualizing modern motor cars. Visitors at the National Automobile Shows will have an opportunity to observe designs far removed from the usual and commonplace. The skillful handling and fine artistry of these original creations fittingly express the personality of the cars upon which they appear.”
This fine artistry of Ternstedt was led by designer and engineer, William Schnell. As head of the Ternstedt Art & Color department and the Die Sinker department from 1924 through 1935, Schnell received over thirty design and manufacturing patents for car mascots as well as countless patents for other trim pieces such as dome lights and door handles. These accomplishments made Schnell, by far, the most successful and prolific designer of the most prized and fashionable car accessories. His marque mascots were symbols of speed, power, elegance, and individuality and have withstood the test of time as they are still highly sought after, often purchased for thousands of dollars by car enthusiasts.
In the 1920s and early 1930s, auto decoration focused on style and beauty. Art Deco was the dominant design form and represented the rapid modernization of fashion in the United States. Many authorities now recognize the 1931 Pierce-Arrow Archer and 1930 Cadillac/LaSalle Goddess as perhaps the most beautiful examples of all Art Deco hood ornaments. These, oft copied and highly collectible pieces, were designed by William Schnell.
Other Art Deco designs by Schnell include the stunning 1927 Buick Goddess and the 1929-1931 Chevrolet Viking. The Buick Goddess was the first integrated radiator cap and mascot used by Buick, replacing the departed motometer. The popularity of the Chevy Viking lasted an impressive three years.
The first Pontiac/Oakland mascots were designed by Schnell beginning with the 1927 Oakland Eagle and a series of famous Pontiac Indian chiefs. Schnell received two patents for the 1928/1929 Pontiac Indians, one for their timeless aesthetic design and another for a unique manufacturing process that used two different metals. The Indian face was cast separately in red copper plate to give the facial features sharper contrast to the chrome-plated hairline.
The automobile industry led America to a more streamlined style during the 1930s. This was a new way of thinking in US manufacturing and reflected the need of the masses for signs of progress during the Great Depression. As such, motorcar ornamentation became sleek and modern. Schnell designed the Chevrolet, Pontiac, and Marmon eagles of this period which expressed the taste and culture of the era and gave Americans a symbol of speed and national patriotism to display on the hoods of their cars.
William Schnell designed the 1926-28 Nash Winged Wave, the 1931 and 1934 Oldsmobile stylized swallows, and dozens of ornate radiator caps. His credentials, however, do not end with his personal designs. Under his direction, Ternstedt also received patents for many other classic hood ornaments of the period including:
1928 Buick Goddess
1929 Buick Mercury
1930-32 Cadillac Heron
1931 Buick Mercury
1931-33 Buick Winged 8
1933 Cadillac Goddess
1933 Oldsmobile Goddess
1933 Buick Goddess
1934 Buick Goddess
1935 Pontiac Indian
William Schnell had a keen eye for automotive design talent and as a leader within Ternstedt, mentored others who developed into valuable contributors to the industry in their own right. Bonnie Lemm, one of the very few women designers and patent holders, advanced under Schnell in a period when women rarely held professional industrial positions.
“He was like a father to me,” explains Al Gonas about his relationship with Schnell. Gonas, age 95, served his apprenticeship under Schnell. And it was Gonas that Schnell sent to archery school to learn to pose properly to become the model for the famed Pierce Arrow archer. Gonas went on to serve General Motors as a patent holder and engineering supervisor for 50 years. He further explains, “William Schnell headed the first styling studio for General Motors. That alone should get him recognition. But what put Schnell above everybody else was that he was gifted artistically and in manufacturing.”
WWII and further advancements in streamlining spelled the death of the individualism represented by the auto mascot. By the early 1940s, ornate hood ornaments were gone. William Schnell moved on to be founder of the Michigan Die Casting Company in Detroit, where he continued to design and manufacture automotive hardware for the rest of his long and notable career.
William C. Williams, the recognized authority on the history of automotive hood ornaments and author of Motoring Mascots of the World, said this about Schnell:
“The activities of the mascot designer are generally anonymous. This was not so with William Schnell and his notable output of American mascots and radiator caps. His brilliant mind left us with the most classic ornaments including the 1934 Pontiac, 1931 Cadillac Goddess, and the nude Pierce Arrow archers of the 1930s. Without the remarkable talents and flare of William Schnell the American motor industry would be a poorer place.”
Little is known about the personal life of William Schnell. However, what we do know about him signifies a gentle, loving, giving, and accomplished man in all facets of his life. Schnell was married to his bride, Gertrud, for sixty years. He was a caring and generous father, grandfather, and great-grandfather. He loved travel, baseball, and yachting. He spent nearly every weekend on his boat with his family and as an early member of the Bayview Yacht Club, he often loaned his boats to the Coast Guard in Detroit when needed.
My husband has been restoring an old car that was given to him in pieces. He has it put together as far as he can. We are not sure of the year or exact model. The following was found on the car:
FISHER.BODY.CORP
DETROIT MICH.
correspondence pertaining to the
body bear these numbers
JOB N0. 30551
BODY NO.0 9884
Do you happen to have any information or picture of the above? I would appreciate your help.
Thank you
Just wondering if anyone would have pictures of this vehicle or information about it?
My grandfather Bill is still around and very healthy. Finding this picture on the internet, and to read some of your comments has been pretty neat in furthering my knowledge behind the family business.